After more than 32,000 speeding tickets were handed out in just three weeks by new automated speed enforcement cameras in community safety zones, council in the City of Vaughan decided to pause the program.
Mayor Steven Del Duca put forward the motion last week to pause the tickets until September, when council is due to receive a report from staff on ways the city can create more effective signage about the presence of cameras.
Sounds like they were working as intended. In France they have speed cameras on the highway that average your speed over a distance and mail speeders tickets too, should be everywhere. Silly to stop such a wildly successful public safety campaign, if anything it’s clear this is a real problem and the program should be expanded. Why is signage needed? Follow the rules and don’t get a ticket is already a very well publicized concept, don’t speed and the cameras aren’t a problem
Design the roads so that they are unpleasant to use above the speed you are trying to achieve. This method has had great success in the Netherlands.
Over the summer months, when the cameras snap a pic of a speeder they will receive a warning in the mail rather than a fine. The city says it hopes the strategy will reduce driving speeds through awareness rather than punitive measures.
This is an intelligent and measured move. Make citizens aware that enforcement exists. Then, after making them aware that they’re being monitored, turn on fines. The goal is to reduce speeding drivers, not to collect revenue.
The goal is to reduce speeding drivers, not to collect revenue.
Then there’s cities like Winnipeg where successive city halls have decided that speeding tickets are the bestest cash cow ever!
That cash should go directly into the city to redesign these problems roadways created for cars into streets designed for people.
It should be 1 warning then you get tickets. Right now speeders can keep getting as many warnings as they want and wait to hear on the news when the fines will be implemented.
Most people I know get several 11-15km over tickets all at once a month after the infraction. They’ve already noticed or been told about the machine by the time they get the first ticket, and adjusted their driving.
That’s a better approach. Cheers.
Or, fix the speed limit problem? If a lot of people are doing a certain limit through an area, clearly the limit is the problem… Cities keep lowering speed limits everywhere when traffic seems to struggle to reach limits in the first place. Not sure what exactly they’re expecting to have happen.
Pedestrain safety becomes a concern at higher speeds. Collisons become more intense and more deadly as speed increases. The drivers are the problem, not the speed limit.
If the cars aren’t able to reach the limit due to traffic, how did the cameras hand out so many speeding tickets?
At 30kph, a pedestrian hit by a car survives 90% of the time.
At 50kph, it’s 50/50 if a pedestrian dies.
At 70kph, it’s 90/10 dead body.
As someone in that lucky 10%, I’m all for more enforcement of speed limits.
Wow fuck cars all roads should be 30kph
Great, so set the limits to 70kmh so pedestrians stop being so careless, or lower the limits and put more pedestrian crossings in place.
I walk and drive frequently. Pedestrian safety is important, but we shouldn’t be coddling morons who can’t be safe pedestrians. What the fuck happened to looking both ways and nkt wearing headphones etc? Pedestrian safety has gone to the wayside and instead we’re going after drivers?
When did these cameras catch the drivers? Was it during rush hour or was it at 3am when there was little traffic on the road in the first place? How much over the limit were these people doing? There’s an awful lot of important data missing here.
And yes, the drivers are absolutely the problem yet we keep lowering the limits instead of pulling the shit drivers with 0 reflex and the reaction time of a potato off the road.
Not sure what exactly they’re expecting to have happen.
Great opportunity to go inform yourself then :-)
Inform myself of what? The 10 year old crossing the empty street at 3am on a school night? Sure…
If other cars would just fucking do the limit and not take years to get there, there would be far less speeding. I know I’m mostly doing it to make up for lost time from all the dumb fucks I’m stuck behind/beside because they can’t keep the fuck up with traffic
Aaand there it is. You’re a speeder and therefore a dangerous driver and refuse to take responsibility for the fact that you are making roadways more dangerous for yourself and everyone around you. You don’t see yourself as a bad person, so the fact that people like you could get punished for behaving in a way you think is fine and redeemabke makes you angry. You’re impatient and want to save a few minutes of “lost time” from traffic and believe the solution is to speed rather than leaving a few minutes earlier, advocating for traffic calming measures, fewer cards on the road, more effective roadways, effective public transportation etc. all of which would make it safer and easier for everyone, including yourself, to make it where they need to go on time.
Road ways are designed with something like a safety factor where a 50kph road way Is safe up to 80kph. It’s just reduced for those stunned types of us.
The real reason is the local politicians and their families started getting tickets too, and they’re not happy. So the program has been put on pause.
Ding Ding Ding.
If they had given council members a device to shut off the cameras for themselves and rich donors then they wouldn’t have shut it down.
Maybe they should consider changing the speed limits a bit.
The solution is better road-way design and classifications.
Changing a speed limit sign on a roadway does not change the roadways “designed” or “perceived” speed limit.
When changing signage, the roadway also need to change.
Example, you can’t increase the signed speed limit to 100 kph on a residential street without first a complete redesign of said street into a hwy. This is done by removing driveways, speedbumps, crosswalks, stop signs, and roundabouts. Without this redesign of the roadway this residential street would not make a really good hwy. The exact reverse is true. A hwy does not make a good residential street.
People always say that, and while yes it is true that wider lanes, less intersections, and less roadside hazards do make the road feel like you can speed, use your goddamn speedometer.
People are thinking breathing creatures. Idgaf if the road feels like I could go 100km/hr, if the sign says 50, I’m not flying at 100 down the road because I can think and be aware. At the end of the day, speeding is a CHOICE. Road design can make it feel slow or painful to do the speed limit, but if you can’t override that feeling and pay attention while driving, you don’t deserve a license.
It’s a Skill issue, just don’t speed, it’s literally so easy. If you can’t control your speed just take the bus or a taxi!!
When 80 zones go down to 70 and 60 zones fuck that shit. New houses got built, the limit was 80 if people don’t like living near an 80kmh road, don’t buy that house… It was bad enough being forced to do 60-70 because people took ages to get up to the limit when it was 80. Now we’re doing 50-60 because the same people struggle to get up to speed once again.
How about everywhere that isn’t a side street just becomes an 80 zone and we start aggressively ticketing distracted drivers, distracted pedestrians, and people who can’t handle things like driving in the correct lane, and people who can’t properly use a turn indicator? You know, the actual problems…
Ticketing distracted pedestrians? What kinda garbage city do you wanna live in lmao
Out of curiosity, what do you view as a well designed city that would be a good example of what you want to see more of
I walk as much as I drive. The people I see crossing the street while staring at their phone and/or wearing headphones is wild. As are the Leo who stand as close to the edge of the sidewalk as possible waiting for the light of to change, but you can’t do much there.
You also get people crossing when the hand is up, which should also be a ticketable offense.
Not a garbage city, a city with equal responsibility and accountability.
If we’re going to push for lower speed limits then I want to see adequate crosswalks, and vehicles and pedestrians being equally fined for infractions.
Neither activity is difficult business, yet we have a staggering amount of people driving who shouldn’t be, and pedestrians who are gonna end up in the hospital due to their own stupidity.
It is also a infrastructure issue. When the lane of a 40km road is built exactly as a freeway lane and drivers have been allowed to creep the average speed to 15-20 over the limit, it can literally feel like you’re the one doing wrong when doing the limit as most other cars fly past you.
The psychological effects of lane size, other vehicle speeds, and overall roadway design needs to be considered if we actually want to make our streets safer.
council is due to receive a report from staff on ways the city can create more effective signage about the presence of cameras.
Are you fucking kidding me?
It’s like pointing out to thieves where all the cameras in a bank are.
The speed limit sign is the only information drivers need. If they are going faster, it’s a ticket.
These automated speed cameras seem to be working exactly as intended. The 32,000 speeders can go fuck right off.
I don’t get cameras except as a way to get fines money. If you wanted to actually slow traffic, you’d spend that infrastructure money on calming measures that work immediately and constantly. Cameras take effect weeks after the offence (in a small number of people) and only serves to make people watch for cameras instead of the traffic around them. Cameras have a very small area of effect and only for people that see them or know where they are.
If the point is just to punish speeders, make money, and not fix the problem, then by all means, install a few cameras.
All I know know is that I only needed to get one speeding ticket for me to never speed again.
And that was in a speed trap, not because I wanted to be an ass on the road. An 80km/h country road suddenly turned to 50km/h without a warning, and I was already slowing down…
That was over 20 years ago, but I digress.
If people are constantly getting tickets, they should have mandatory driving school and a retest. But still ticket them so their habit can pay for better infrastructure in the meantime 🤑
IDK where you live, but where I am you get demerits and after a certain number you get a suspension and need to take a course to get your license back. But cameras don’t count to demerits, so if you have enough money, speed away. Taking that money for cameras and putting cops on the ground handing out demeritable tickets would accomplish something; cameras do not.
I’d love to see enforcement that leads to demerit points. But you need a revenue stream to pay for officers on the ground, and nobody wants to pay more in taxes to compensate.
Either we use the revenue to fund traffic cops, or we set fines high enough (but proportional to income or net worth) in order for it to be self-sufficient.
We’re far too lenient on drivers that can’t drive safely.
The cost of a couple of cameras is significantly less investment and significantly less disruption than the needed infrastructure changes. We are talking 10s of thousands to operate the cameras versus millions to rehabilitate just 1 road. We need to fight for roads to be upgraded to safer standards when they are due for repaving.
I mean I think its fine if people “know” the places they have to slow down for the cameras, if those places pose a greater risk of damage/injury from speeding than others.
Sometimes I see police cruisers on the side of the road flashing their lights on which seems like a similar principle: they aren’t trying to catch anyone but they are trying to slow them down through the area and it’s effective.
I mean I think its fine if people “know” the places they have to slow down for the cameras
What that does is cause people to slow down where the cameras are, then speed up where they aren’t.
If drivers assume that cameras are everywhere, watching and waiting to ticket them, maybe they’ll just go the posted speed limit.
If we just assume the government is always watching everything we do, there will be no crime! Let’s install cameras everywhere, including in your home, and we can get to 0% crime! What could go wrong?
Driving is a right, not a privilege.
Speed enforcement cameras (and red light cameras) are doing something that we don’t have the money to do via traffic officers.
Roads should be watched and laws enforced. Because people killing people with their vehicle shouldn’t be something we view as normal or acceptable, IMO.
The idea of speed cameras is to get drivers to slow down. To have 30k tickets after their install shows that they’re not doing the job of getting people to slow down.
The idea of speed cameras is to get drivers to slow down.
It’s one strategy that works for some people. Speed bumps work for others. Narrow streets work for others. And so on.
It’s also one of the least expensive ways to deter speeding, recoup the costs of infrastructure, and enforce the law.
To have 30k tickets after their install shows that they’re not doing the job of getting people to slow down.
They just installed them! It’s not like the same people are getting 100 tickets. At least, I hope not. If they are, mandatory retest should be required to drive again.
I think the takeaway is that speed cameras won’t deter speeding because it’s endemic and engrained in the traffic flow. Perhaps the thoughtful pause will determine that traffic calming measures like medians and speed bumps are required. Maybe they’ll install spike strips and speed sensing missiles. Probably a good idea to go to Council meetings to find out.
I think the takeaway is that speed cameras won’t deter speeding
That’s not true.
Numerous cities report lower overall speeds, and a reduction in traffic collisions when automated cameras are deployed.
For example, https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/annoying-thing-speed-cameras-ottawa-they-work-1.6786951 and https://www.sudbury.com/local-news/speed-cameras-proved-effective-at-latest-locations-10758040.
When my city installed the first speed camera, it clocked over 100,000 speeders in 40 days. Unfortunately, we gave drivers a grace period, so no fines were issued at the beginning.
But in those areas, speeding was reduced.
I’d rather have roads designed to be slow and require attention to navigate, but good luck getting anyone to listen to that. Trying to get any speed reduction strategies to be implemented is very difficult because of NIMBYs.
I guess I misspoke. I meant to say that they aren’t detering speeding yet.
In my rural area they are putting 50km signs in the middle of the road on the yellow lines. Makes you feel like you’re threading a needle.
Its only been 3 weeks and we don’t have much data on how many of them were repeat offenders. We need to give more time for peoples driving habits to adapt to the consequences.
The cameras are much cheaper than cops are for the same level of enforcement and the revenue can be used to further invest in roadway safety like lane narrowing and traffic calming.
The truth is, the speeding issue has been many years in the making as enforcement hasn’t been able to keep up with the number of drivers and 15-20 over became normalized. We aren’t going to reverse that trend in just 3 weeks.
We need to give more time for peoples driving habits to adapt to the consequences.
Absolutely. And increase signage and do the other things. Council doesn’t want to look like they’re praying on constituents to raise funds. The goal is to reduce speed, not increase revenue. I feel like taking a moment to assess the situation is a rational approach.
